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What is a saint? Robert Ellsberg joins Cathedral Dean Samuel T. Lloyd III to discuss the history and present-day relevance of saints.

Ellsberg, editor-in-chief and publisher of Orbis Books, observes that believers are moving away from the idea of saints as heavenly patrons or quasi supernatural heroes of the remote past. He perceives renewed interest in the original first-century notion that saints are human beings with extraordinary faith: “Saints were people who walked faithfully and heroically in the path of Christ…who showed us in some vivid way what it really means to be a disciple.” Saints thus encourage believers amid their own struggles and journeys.

In much traditional church art, saints are shown holding the instrument of their mortification or martyrdom. This portrayal might make sainthood look unachievable or just plain unappealing. Ellsberg draws a fuller picture: “The actual saints were people who stood out among their contemporaries…who showed some aspect of the divine, and not in a way that took away from their humanity…but set a standard for what it means to be a human being.” Ellsberg cites Dorothy Day, with whom he worked at The Catholic Worker, as an example of fully human saintliness. Day is now a candidate for sainthood in the Roman Catholic Church.

Mother Teresa of Calcutta, whom Ellsberg calls a “paradigmatic living saint” and “holy celebrity,” serves as an example of sainthood in spite of her own lengthy struggles of belief. She remained faithful to her life’s work among the poor and dying.

What are the spiritual needs of our time, and how might saints address that need? Ellsberg discusses the saintly qualities of Vincent Van Gogh, “a deeply religious artist, also a very neurotic and tortured person.” In Ellsberg’s view, “You don’t have to be a cheerful and happy and a perfect example of mental health.” Van Gogh was “deeply concerned with trying to depict a certain religious view of reality, to show ordinary reality imbued with mystery and love.”

Ellsberg’s book All Saints explores his concepts of sainthood, which extends well beyond his own Roman Catholic background to include Gandhi, Martin Luther King, Jr., and many others.

“The full number of saints is known to God alone,” Ellsberg summarizes.

About the Guest

Robert Ellsberg is publisher and editor-in-chief of Orbis Books and author of All Saints: Daily Reflections on Saints, Prophets, and Witnesses for Our Time; The Saints’ Guide to Happiness, and Blessed Among All Women: Women Saints, Prophets, and Witnesses for Our Time.

• More about Robert Ellsberg.

• Visit Orbis Books.
• Order Robert Ellsberg’s books.
• Read an excerpt from All Saints:.
• Read an excerpt from The Saints’ Guide to Happiness.
• Read an interview with Robert Ellsberg on Seeds of Unfolding.
• Read an interview with Robert Ellsberg on The Social Edge.